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Hi, I want to upgrade my RBC intake manifold. Porting is pricey and I rather just get a better intake manifold and sell my RBC.

The options that I seen that are better then the RBC is the Skunk2 and RRC.

I seen dyno where the RRC outperforms but on the other side Skunk2 just posted up dyno showing their intake manifold outperforms the RRC.

Here is the link from Skunk2 showing the Skunk better then the RRC
http://cms.skunk2.com/id/492/K-Series-Data-Is-In/

Here is a link from super street mag showing the RRC is the top.
http://www.superstreetonline.com/techarticles/sstp_1002_k_series_intake_manifold_shootout/index.html

Say both were the same price, which one would you go for?

My current setup is:
2009 Civic Si
K20z3, 2008 TSX CAMSHAFT, Hondata Flashpro, AEM CAI V2, BPI Velocity Stack, Skunk2 Race Header, Invidia Q300 Catback, 2006 TSX Throttle Body, Hondata Intake Manifold Gasket, P2R Intake Throttle Body Spacer, and P2R Throttle Body Gasket.

I am planning to get my car tuned at church automotive soon, so this intake manifold would be my last mod with this car.

Do you guys think upgrading the intake manifold will net 6-8hp from the RBC?
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
I also notice on the super street mag, they stated they mess with the cam angle and ignition with the RRC intake manifold and they didn’t state this with any of the other intake manifold. I was thinking maybe the gains were mainly from the tuning. Did the other intake manifold have ignition and cam angle tuning as the RRC? If not, then I don’t think it is a far comparison. I know people on this forum were helping conduct the test for super street. Hopefully they can input their thoughts.

Thanks
 

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Hey fellow 8th gen! I think for us the choice is a no brainer. The RRC is a direct swap, plus the piece of mind that comes with OEM Honda parts. The IAC is eliminated since we have DBW and it already has the coolant port built in. Plus no need to relocate your intake. I have the RRC on my k24a2 build and like it a lot.

The skunk2 was made more for k20 swaps into other chassis. I know the water port is relocated and you need an adapter plate for the dbw throttle body. Not to mention reroute the intake system.

As far as dyno's go, that is debatable. Most of what I have read favors the RRC and there is still room to expand with that mani. The s2, what you buy is what you get.
 

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Hey fellow 8th gen! I think for us the choice is a no brainer. The RRC is a direct swap, plus the piece of mind that comes with OEM Honda parts. The IAC is eliminated since we have DBW and it already has the coolant port built in. Plus no need to relocate your intake. I have the RRC on my k24a2 build and like it a lot.

The skunk2 was made more for k20 swaps into other chassis. I know the water port is relocated and you need an adapter plate for the dbw throttle body. Not to mention reroute the intake system.

As far as dyno's go, that is debatable. Most of what I have read favors the RRC and there is still room to expand with that mani. The s2, what you buy is what you get.
I agree with Rhino... and Rhino, did you notice any gains with the RRC on the K24a2? Everyon protests that (just like the Skunk2).. the RRC is made for top end...usually referring to K20s..and looses some torque down low. I'm asking becuase Im doing a k24 build and even though ppl recommended the RBC over the RRC for the K24.. I felt like porting an RBC is almost like having an RRC..thus making the RRC cheaper in comparison...

to the OP..sorry for a slight Threadjack..but yes in my opinion..I'd definitely go with the RRC. No offense to Skunk2 but I remember when I was building my H22...the H22 Euro R manifold was the equivalent of the RBC..pretty much the best bang for the buck IM out there..and Skunk2 decided to make an IM to compete with it...it turns out as people all across Honda-Tech (at the time) were dynoing the Skunk2 and LOSING power. Granted thats a different manifold, different motor, it was enough to convince me that a popular brand doesn't always mean more power.
 

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for your z3 id go with the RRC just like rhino said bolts right on for you!
but for the k24a2 ive seen the rbc get beat by the stock RBB so i dunno even if the RRC would be good for k24s :confused:
I have a feeling its going to be one of those application dependent things... some ppl building K24s may not mind sacrificing torque for HP... but i wouldn't be surprised if there are setups on the K24 where you may retain torque and still gain some ponies.
 

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I agree with Rhino... and Rhino, did you notice any gains with the RRC on the K24a2? Everyon protests that (just like the Skunk2).. the RRC is made for top end...usually referring to K20s..and looses some torque down low. I'm asking becuase Im doing a k24 build and even though ppl recommended the RBC over the RRC for the K24.. I felt like porting an RBC is almost like having an RRC..thus making the RRC cheaper in comparison...
I don't have any comparison before and after dyno's to tell you for sure if the manifold itself made a difference. I can tell from my recent dyno tune that I did not have to sacrifice any torque what so ever to go with the RRC and I think it performed nicely!

I put down 234whp and 192tq with the following setup:
-Stock 08 k24a2 long block with 50deg vtc
-RRC IM
-64mm TSX TB
-RDX Inj
-Injen CAI
-Go-Power k24 RH w/ 3" collector
-Full Race 3" Exhaust

I do have the graph to back it up. Im just not trying to thread jack.

I guess that can put to rest the debate over the RRC making good power with a k24. I think part of the success though was the extra bump from the large 06+ tsx cams and a 3" exhaust. I think unless you are fully built the RRC will do the job just fine. I can still port this manifold in the future if need be.
 

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I don't have any comparison before and after dyno's to tell you for sure if the manifold itself made a difference. I can tell from my recent dyno tune that I did not have to sacrifice any torque what so ever to go with the RRC and I think it performed nicely!

I put down 234whp and 192tq with the following setup:
-Stock 08 k24a2 long block with 50deg vtc
-RRC IM
-64mm TSX TB
-RDX Inj
-Injen CAI
-Go-Power k24 RH w/ 3" collector
-Full Race 3" Exhaust

I do have the graph to back it up. Im just not trying to thread jack.

I guess that can put to rest the debate over the RRC making good power with a k24. I think part of the success though was the extra bump from the large 06+ tsx cams and a 3" exhaust. I think unless you are fully built the RRC will do the job just fine. I can still port this manifold in the future if need be.
Thanks for the tip.. I'll be running KMEs on 12.5 so the motor will be breathing well. I really don't think its threadjacking to be honest as its valuable info that may sway the OPs opinion on which to go with.:up:
 

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I also notice on the super street mag, they stated they mess with the cam angle and ignition with the RRC intake manifold and they didn’t state this with any of the other intake manifold. I was thinking maybe the gains were mainly from the tuning. Did the other intake manifold have ignition and cam angle tuning as the RRC? If not, then I don’t think it is a far comparison. I know people on this forum were helping conduct the test for super street. Hopefully they can input their thoughts.

Thanks
FYI all the manifolds were individually (fully) tuned in the SS test... I supplied the RRC & endyn RBB for the test :D

on CRSX a member tested the RRC vs a ported RBC (w/plenum spaced) & the RRC (slightly) beat out the worked RBC
 

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I don't have any comparison before and after dyno's to tell you for sure if the manifold itself made a difference. I can tell from my recent dyno tune that I did not have to sacrifice any torque what so ever to go with the RRC and I think it performed nicely!

I put down 234whp and 192tq with the following setup:
-Stock 08 k24a2 long block with 50deg vtc
-RRC IM
-64mm TSX TB
-RDX Inj
-Injen CAI
-Go-Power k24 RH w/ 3" collector
-Full Race 3" Exhaust

I do have the graph to back it up. Im just not trying to thread jack.

I guess that can put to rest the debate over the RRC making good power with a k24. I think part of the success though was the extra bump from the large 06+ tsx cams and a 3" exhaust. I think unless you are fully built the RRC will do the job just fine. I can still port this manifold in the future if need be.
Nice numbers for your setup
 

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Porting is pricey but at the end you will have an intake manifold that moves more air then either of those two.
FYI all the manifolds were individually (fully) tuned in the SS test... I supplied the RRC & endyn RBB for the test :D

on CRSX a member tested the RRC vs a ported RBC (w/plenum spaced) & the RRC (slightly) beat out the worked RBC
sorry Blueprint, but you are wrong. a ported RBC is not better than a stock RRC. we have also tested this on seek167's car and got better results with a stock RRC. they were both tuned for best results. http://www.k20a.org/forum/showthread.php?t=71489

RRC= best bang for the buck :up:
 

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FYI all the manifolds were individually (fully) tuned in the SS test...
They were tuned but I dont think fully is true. I wont discount the parties efforts, it was not easy and no one made any money doing it, but I'm sure if you had a paying customer for each for each combo... the results would have been different. Seeing how no one else had/ has stepped up to do a test like that... its the best test we've got.

on CRSX a member tested the RRC vs a ported RBC (w/plenum spaced) & the RRC (slightly) beat out the worked RBC
The port job (the person and their experience), the motor, and the tune (the person and their experience) have everything to do with the results... it's not fair to say the ported RBC lost to a stock RRC without explaining the factors.

Ported manifold sales have dropped as a result of people reading posts like this and not understanding that every motor is different and that results will vary greatly based on a host of additional factors.

Is a ported RBC for everybody? No. Will a stock manifold out perform a ported manifold? If the engine does not need a ported manifold, absolutely!


the Skunk manifold is $500. and it costs $500 to port your RBC. Personally I'd port your RBC and have the best flow, or get an RRC. OEM > Skunk2 anyday.
What you say makes total sense and I agree but the owner is counting on selling his manifold to offset the cost... he can potentially make $125-150
 

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I saw they we're tuning the PRC manifold to an A/F of 14.5:1 why is that? Where all manifolds tuned to this A/F?

PS obviously skunk would advertise their manifold to make more power over the RRC or else theyd be screwed, hard to beleive them since they made the product and are pushing it.

Now test them on FI engines and both crowds will like you :D.

What's the going rate of an RRC these days roughly?
 

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sorry Blueprint, but you are wrong. a ported RBC is not better than a stock RRC. we have also tested this on seek167's car and got better results with a stock RRC. they were both tuned for best results. http://www.k20a.org/forum/showthread.php?t=71489
My response applies to your comment as well...

The port job (the person and their experience), the motor, and the tune (the person and their experience) have everything to do with the results... it's not fair to say the ported RBC lost to a stock RRC without explaining the factors.

Ported manifold sales have dropped as a result of people reading posts like this and not understanding that every motor is different and that results will vary greatly based on a host of additional factors.

Is a ported RBC for everybody? No. Will a stock manifold out perform a ported manifold? If the engine does not need a ported manifold, absolutely!
 

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I agree with Blueprint on the subject.

Church Automotive testing has tested the stock RBC vs. RRC manifold in back to back tests. After fully tuning the A/F ratios and cam angles, the RRC only makes 1-3hp over the stock RBC. You can call Ryan or Daniel at Church to verify this post.

However, I have built two almost identical "K20's" with simple bolt-on's and have seen huge gains from ported head & manifold combo.

Stock K20Z1 w/ SK2S2 Cams, Mugen thin headgasket, stock RBC Manifold, 70mm throttle body, Rcrew header, 3"in CAI w/ velocity stack
http://www.k20a.org/forum/showthread.php?t=42987


Stock K20A w/ SK2S2 Cams, Mugen thin headgasket, RBC Manifold, 74mm throttle body, Rcrew header, 3"in CAI w/ velocity stack
Upgraded Blueprint Racing Ported head and Manifold
http://www.k20a.org/forum/showthread.php?t=74977


Note that these setups where dyno'd on the same exact Dyno with similar weather conditions.

There is a 23 whp difference between these two setups. The only real major difference is the ported head/manifold setup and slightly .2:1 increase in compression.
 

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Porting is pricey but at the end you will have an intake manifold that moves more air then either of those two.
my thoughts...plus you get the advantage of being able to do a perfect port match cause you can run a feeler gauge down the runnners while the manifold is bolt-ed up. You can even take it ine step further and aline the Hondata IMG or custom IMG...thus getting thr most out of your new intake manifold bolt on
 
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