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Discussion Starter #1
Hey People,

So after I/H/E and CT-Eng SC running a 3" pulley and a half ass Hondata tune these are the results...

- 270 WHP @ 8k rpm @ 10.6 PSI.
- 252 Nm Torque @ 5.6k rpm.
It makes 297 WHP @ 9k rpm but we have set the redline to 8k as it's a track car don't want to kill it too soon with the hot temps...

Can someone please explain to me where and how do you get significantly more WHP with a turbo at the same boost levels?

I was aiming for around 330 WHP but this seems to be impossible with a stock K20, with cams I think 330 WHP would be achievable?
 

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I would have to go with parasitic drag and the 'half ass tune' you spoke of. As you know the supercharger robs a little power in the process of compressing the intake charge. Plus with the turbos there is an intercooler (usually) that lowers the temp of the incoming air. So no extra drag on the motor + cooler IAT= more power/lb of boost.
 

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My tuner made 277whp 175tq at 7psi on a jackson supercharger.
 

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My tuner made 277whp 175tq at 7psi on a jackson supercharger.
I have to call BS on that one. I haven't seen a roots style charger on a k-series that has made that power at that boost level.
 

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I will try to get a graph from the dyno. Onix made over 300 at 10 psi.
 

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Hey People,

So after I/H/E and CT-Eng SC running a 3" pulley and a half ass Hondata tune these are the results...

- 270 WHP @ 8k rpm @ 10.6 PSI.
- 252 Nm Torque @ 5.6k rpm.
It makes 297 WHP @ 9k rpm but we have set the redline to 8k as it's a track car don't want to kill it too soon with the hot temps...

Can someone please explain to me where and how do you get significantly more WHP with a turbo at the same boost levels?

I was aiming for around 330 WHP but this seems to be impossible with a stock K20, with cams I think 330 WHP would be achievable?
Size of turbo has to be considered, so different volumes of CFM. And the other two already mentioned, parasitic loss and lower IATs. A full tune may improve your results slightly, but not up to what you desire.
 

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i'm sure with a full tune and with cams, yes, 330 is achievable. Tune alone could probably net you another 10-20 ft/lbs of torque and hp
 

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Hey People,

So after I/H/E and CT-Eng SC running a 3" pulley and a half ass Hondata tune these are the results...

- 270 WHP @ 8k rpm @ 10.6 PSI.
- 252 Nm Torque @ 5.6k rpm.
It makes 297 WHP @ 9k rpm but we have set the redline to 8k as it's a track car don't want to kill it too soon with the hot temps...

Can someone please explain to me where and how do you get significantly more WHP with a turbo at the same boost levels?

I was aiming for around 330 WHP but this seems to be impossible with a stock K20, with cams I think 330 WHP would be achievable?
Hmmm, I would also guess the tune is killing you. The cams definitely won't hurt though. To be honest, I was pretty impressed with the torque curve when I opened your pdf (did you use microsoft paint or something to make the line more obvious?). That torque curve is a lot more even than you'll see on a lot of turbo cars. Just because you're not making as much peak power and/or torque as a turbo car doesn't mean you wouldn't win a race against a turbo car with similar mods making a bit more peak power. There's a lot to be said for a nice, smooth torque band. Granted, that sort of torque would be put to better use on a road course than a drag strip in most cases.

Definitely post up your graphs after you get the cams and a good dyno tune. :up:

peace,
russ
 

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I don't find that hard to believe.
My friend with a k20a2 in a RSX with a JRSC @ 11PSI with DCRH, exhaust, & CAI made only 278whp & 167ft/lbs which is why I have a hard time believing that someone made the same power at 7psi on a blower. Hell, most people even with a turbo setup don't make but around that power on that same boost level and a turbo is far more efficient than a SC
 

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^^On my Jrsc with all supporting mods and complete tune I made 280whp.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Thanks heaps for the feedback guys....

I was down at my work shop this afternoon they actually sent me the graphs of the 1st ECU (as per the attachments) the results are pretty much exactly the same accept on the current (running at the moment) 2nd ECU the peak power is 211.8kW (284WHP) @ 8k which means it should be over 300 WHP at 9k rpm :)

No paint job on the graph ~ the Torque curve is very impressive and being a circuit car it's really nice.. currently working on the suspension to make the most of the power... I'm pretty happy with it at the moment :)

A soon as Hondata wakes up and releases a K-Pro or something so we can tune the car I will be dropping in some IPS Ksc cams...
 

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Discussion Starter #14
i'm sure with a full tune and with cams, yes, 330 is achievable. Tune alone could probably net you another 10-20 ft/lbs of torque and hp
OK so your a good tuner... Knowing my current setup what would happen if I put some Toda cams into the motor?

a) would it run OK and would the A/F remain pretty much the same, without the need to adjust anything?
b) how much extra timing and at what rpms would you suggest (having a stab in the dark)? e.g. at 4000 + 4deg, 4200 + 6deg etc..? :dance:
 

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are you running a water/meth injection set up? The CT and JR superchargers major drawback is they blow hot har over 10psi. Cool the charge... add a little octane boost, and more hp BAM!!!!!!
 

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OK so your a good tuner... Knowing my current setup what would happen if I put some Toda cams into the motor?

a) would it run OK and would the A/F remain pretty much the same, without the need to adjust anything?
b) how much extra timing and at what rpms would you suggest (having a stab in the dark)? e.g. at 4000 + 4deg, 4200 + 6deg etc..? :dance:
Scuffers has tested a set of Toda cams with a S/C build, maybe he'll chime in.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
are you running a water/meth injection set up? The CT and JR superchargers major drawback is they blow hot har over 10psi. Cool the charge... add a little octane boost, and more hp BAM!!!!!!
I do understand that these chargers start to blow some hot temps above 10 psi - I have not looked into water/meth injection what so ever.

What ones / who's / kit would you recommend for my setup? Are they a recirculating system as I don't want to be refilling tanks (like NOS setups) just for cooling purposes...?
 

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I do understand that these chargers start to blow some hot temps above 10 psi - I have not looked into water/meth injection what so ever.

What ones / who's / kit would you recommend for my setup? Are they a recirculating system as I don't want to be refilling tanks (like NOS setups) just for cooling purposes...?
Welcome to supercharging buddy, the m62 shits it's pants the minute you start touching double digit numbers, this will become your friend:

http://www.snowperformance.net/product.php?pk=8
 

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Some of the things said in this thread are..... not that true. The water/meth is your best bet and the route I am going myself. You can also custom make an aftercooler. K20a.org is deffinitly not the place to be for k series s/c information. Check out the charger section of clubrsx.

Archull I think the reason your buddy isn't make slightly larger numbers on that kind of boost is due to the DC header, the less boost registered = more flow = more power. Hopefully that makes some sense. ALSO keep in mind your buddy NEEDS a form of cooling! Over on crsx it is a known fact that you only go to 11lbs with water/meth or an aftercooler. I would guess that the tune is holding the motor back and possibly holding the motor together because of all the heat generated at 11psi.

Edit: Most of the guys making the big numbers on the charger are running stock cams. I personally think cams would be a waste of money and or reliability/driveability. Invest more in the bolt ons to take advantage of the charger like free flowing exhaust and header, water/meth, TUNE, etc. If you can get a cooling solution you can run 11-15psi which is where the big numbers come in to play like 330+whp.

These are just notes I have taken from builds I have seen using K series blowers on both forums.

Edit: Also keep in mind that some people are running K24's and some K20's and obviously the K24 is going to be bigger and better in every aspect when it comes to the charger. Anything else and that may or maynot be the case.
 

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I do understand that these chargers start to blow some hot temps above 10 psi - I have not looked into water/meth injection what so ever.

What ones / who's / kit would you recommend for my setup? Are they a recirculating system as I don't want to be refilling tanks (like NOS setups) just for cooling purposes...?
Get Aquamist, this is the best kit ive seen on the market, it has a low level safety feature so you dont blow your motor when you run out of meth/water. and by the way its not like refillnig nitrous, all meth is, is windsheild washer concentrate, 98% methyl alcohol.
 
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