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Stock block K20a2. Rbc intake manifold, grams 550 injectors, karcepts intake, rcrew gen 1 header, 3” straight pipe exhaust, kpro tuned by Ericks racing 250 hp 187 tq
C971E9DA-0D45-4026-8FF8-EB4DAAA32B5B.jpeg
 

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Arouse the DAMPFHAMMER!
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Stock block K20a2. Rbc intake manifold, grams 550 injectors, karcepts intake, rcrew gen 1 header, 3” straight pipe exhaust, kpro tuned by Ericks racing 250 hp 187 tq
Welcome to K20a.org Mightymintos. Nice to see Erick is still active and you had the advantage getting your car tuned by a bedrock of Honda K20 tuner. I still don't like the approach he tune the VTEC transition point, while customer like the torque hammer in the neck, but I assume you like his work result very much. Don't you?

Did you made a leakdown and compression test on your engine? It seems to be very healthy, peak torque is beside the kick in peak around 180 ftlb's, assuming it to be rated on flywheel. I would appreciate to see the compression and leakdown test results of it. Also I am curious to know if these are flywheel or axle rated figures.

Markus
 

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Hello,

A bit of EK news:

- The 3"/76mm catback is finished, unfortunately we cannot test the car with the corona :(, but the noise is very contained, perfect! (2 Simons exhaust, a "Turbex" and a "Turbolight")

I plan to go to K24 / K20:
I have the choice between a K24a3 or K24 "jdm 200hp", I think it will be the jdm one!


For bolt-ons, this will remain the SAME except the injectors of 550cc > 850cc (E85) and clutch Exedy st1 > Exedy st2.

I also plan to take the opportunity to porting my head and RBC, but not cams or other (Budget).


According to you and compared to the score previously brought, how much can I hope ???
 

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As a reminder:

Stock K20a2 (EK)


Motor: K20a2 (Full stock)
Header: Megan racing (Rcrew rep)
Cams: Stock
Intake/Fuel: RBC bored 70mm (NOT ported),70 TB Ktuned, 3" tube + Velocity stack filter , 550cc injectors
Exhaust: 2.5" Simons catback
Tranny: EP3 EDM, Dc5 flywheel
Misc Mods: K100
Others: Tegiwa crank pulley

232.24hp/214.3nm
E85 (96.8°F this day!)
 

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Stock K20a2 (EK)


Motor: K20a2 (Full stock)
Header: Megan racing (Rcrew rep)
Cams: Stock
Intake/Fuel: RBC bored 70mm (NOT ported),70 TB Ktuned, 3" tube + Velocity stack filter , 550cc injectors
Exhaust: 2.5" Simons catback
Tranny: EP3 EDM, Dc5 flywheel
Misc Mods: K100
Others: Tegiwa crank pulley

232.24hp/214.3nm
E85 (96.8°F this day!)


I'm awaiting a 3" catback ;)
Damn that’s really good power for 2.5” exhaust !
 

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You find?

It is true that it was very very hot that day (Heat wave in France) and that the mapper did not expect it to come out an honorable score.

(Because not to mention the very high temperature, this score is very common for a K20 with bolt-ons.)

I did not specify it, but it is indeed HP and NOT WHP: Besides, I believe that we do not have a dyno which gives power to the wheels here.

The car is now in 3 "exhaust and soon in electric water pump, depending on the price of the mapper, I will make an adjustment and we will see the score!
 

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Arouse the DAMPFHAMMER!
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@da_sherminator the power figure isn't available? Do you have the duty cycle, fuel and fuel pressure of the injectors at peak power? Just to get an idea of the power level there.

The car is now in 3 "exhaust and soon in electric water pump, depending on the price of the mapper, I will make an adjustment and we will see the score!
What prices do you have in France per hour on a dyno?
 

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@da_sherminator the power figure isn't available? Do you have the duty cycle, fuel and fuel pressure of the injectors at peak power? Just to get an idea of the power level there.

What prices do you have in France per hour on a dyno?
- Yes my friend, I already posted it above, here it is.
However as we were talking about, I do not have this information because performed with a K100.

- No, I don't think there is really an hourly rate, I will try to negotiate with him. I have no knowledge in tune, but I know that the modifications will be minor and therefore fast;)


I don't have drive the car with the 3 "exhaust a lot, but what I can briefly say about it:
  • Loss of torque at low speed
  • The feeling of taking faster rpm
  • A little more "hp" at the top maybe ?!
  • A few dB more ... LOL But this remains very reasonable with 2 Simons Now, I keep in mind that the management was made for a more restrictive exhaust(2.5 "!), To see!
 

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Arouse the DAMPFHAMMER!
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However as we were talking about, I do not have this information because performed with a K100.
Sorry, I've forgot it. That's a pitty, otherwise I could have a look into the calibration and logging files and maybe could tune it remotely.

Did you or your tuner do a compression or leakdown test of your specific engine?

For E85 I would have expected more torque everywhere, even on a 33 °C day with higher humidity. My DAMPFHAMMER engine made on a IAT of 30 °C 274 [email protected] rpm and 23° VTC, the torque curve of your engine tells me your tuner don't know Honda engines. No K-series engine of your setup would have peak torque beyond 7000 rpm. Your tuner should take a lesson in using cam phasing mechanism, Honda calls it VTC mechanism. I expect at least 225-230 Nm from your engine at that day around 5500 rpm. If it is not happening, there is something wrong, you may find out during a leakdown test and a check of the catback and cat-delete pipe, there is maybe a restriction for flow there if VTC isn't tuned wrong.

Please ask your tuner for an picture of the VTC map of High and Low speed cam. The torque curve shows there is something pretty wrong.
 

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Thanks for the dyno sheet. It looks like it has an interesting low speed cam torque curve and VTEC switch point. A pitty you can't download the calibration of the ECU with the K100. Would be interesting to see what the tuner did there.
Thank you, I allowed myself to postpone your previous analysis of the curve compared to my 1st message with the dyno.

Attention, I do not pretend to say anything, so you seem knowledgeable about the field and connoisseur !!! ;)

No, there was no compression or leakdown test, the block is approximately 140kkms.

Okay, what would be shocking would be to get the max torque so soon?

It is possible that he did not consider it important to play with the VTC! I couldn't say.


One of his achievements on a large K20 setup:
HRED Motorsport | Reprogrammation Moteur @ Bordeaux - Civic Type R EP3 F2000 EVO 2 - 300ch & 262Nm
 

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Another friend's dyno, same mapper.

What do you think?


Motor: K20a2 (Full stock, 200kkms)
Header: Dc sport 2.25"
Cams: Stock
Intake/Fuel: M2 manifold 70mm, 70TB
Exhaust: SRS G35 catback 2.25"in
Tranny: EP3 EDM
Misc Mods: K100
98gas
 

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Arouse the DAMPFHAMMER!
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Thank you, I allowed myself to postpone your previous analysis of the curve compared to my 1st message with the dyno.
I am ok with that.

No, there was no compression or leakdown test, the block is approximately 140kkms.
I set this duty in advance of the tuning work, to know the healtyness of the rings and other sealing systems of the combustion chamber. It is a safety and documentation issue for both, the owner and the tuner.

Okay, what would be shocking would be to get the max torque so soon?
Peak torque is mainly driven by the intake manifold and the header and in a 1.5 order ;) are the cams. With your setup max torque should be around 5.5 krpm.

It is possible that he did not consider it important to play with the VTC! I couldn't say.
He should know it quite well as you have shown. That low mid range torque, compared to the peak torque (stock cams!), can show two things: one the VTC map is not optimized (would be the ease to change case), the other the header and exhaust have a restriction, which reduces the capability to breath fully and forces the tuner to keep the VTC retarded. Later is the more worse case, as this issue has to be found and solved.

If you like I can have a second view on it if you send me a picture of the low and high speed VTC map. Or you ask your tuner for the *.cal file, which would give me a more clearer picture of your engine, because you would speak with him in both cases.
 

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Arouse the DAMPFHAMMER!
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Motor: K20a2 (Full stock, 200kkms)...Header: Dc sport 2.25"...Cams: Stock...Intake/Fuel: M2 manifold 70mm, 70TB...Exhaust: SRS G35 catback 2.25"in...98gas
The qualitative shape of the torque curve is the one I would expect from a K20A2 with stock IM, CAI, H and an ID 2.25" exhaust. Most engine setups with stock IM have peak torque around 5500 and hold it until 6500 rpm and then it declines. This IM seems to be a bit different. Do you have more data about the M2 IM? I am curious about it :).
 

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If you like I can have a second view on it if you send me a picture of the low and high speed VTC map. Or you ask your tuner for the *.cal file, which would give me a more clearer picture of your engine, because you would speak with him in both cases.
Yes, I would like you to take a look at it. I would ask him for this file when modifying the map.



The qualitative shape of the torque curve is the one I would expect from a K20A2 with stock IM, CAI, H and an ID 2.25" exhaust. Most engine setups with stock IM have peak torque around 5500 and hold it until 6500 rpm and then it declines. This IM seems to be a bit different. Do you have more data about the M2 IM? I am curious about it :).
Here are 2 pictures of the M2 Motorsport manifold.
 

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Yes, I would like you to take a look at it. I would ask him for this file when modifying the map.
Fine, calibration and a WOT and part load log file would be perfect, calibration alone would be also ok, but less effective for deep diving into it.

Here are 2 pictures of the M2 Motorsport manifold.
Many thanks for the pictures! According the torque curve the VE behavior is pretty different compared to the PRB, PRC, RBC and RRC (all OEM) intake manifolds. Seems it has shorter runners (confirmation of that would be cool :)) as the peak torque happens a bit later with stock cams and the torque plateau is much shorter. This is also causing the little dip before VTEC, as VTEC switch point a bit later compared to OEM IM/OEM cams combinations with the DC 4-2-1 header for the EP3




Is it this header?
 

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SO iam back :)

Took the motor out of the accord did a personal best of 13.1 with it replaced it with a stock motor and box sold the car.

I now have the old motor in a mr2 spyder :)

exact same setup.

K24a3 stock sub k20z4 head ported crower 402
Intake ultra race
TB ktuned 80mm
90 mm CP SRI
NB accord modified header
3inch 2 box system
RDX Injectors
Kpro

only difference here is i have the ultra race intake with ktuned 80mm tb and kpro instead of flashpro also 3inch
2 box exhaust.

I had the car on the rollers and the car is actually making slightly more power with less timing.

Previous run on this specific dyno i only managed to make 197 kw that was on the accord.

IMG-20200513-WA0079.jpg
 

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That's great 20v_lover! Don't you life at 1600 m above sea level? Atmospheric pressure relates to around 0-50 m above sea level. What was the injector duty cycle at peak power?
Hi, yes that's correct.
duty if i am not mistaken was in the high 70s about 76 78 IMG-20200430-WA0045.jpg percent i might still have a log on the Kpro i will pull it and confirm if there is still one or i will just do a log to check once the weather clears it's winter here now.

I did another guys car civic fn2 type r k24 as well.

k24/k20
Headwork
VT supertech
BC stage 3
Comp just under 12.0
BC Rods
20 thou Supertech pistons
My old RRC intake with J37 TB
RDX injectors
NB header 3 inch 2 box exhaust.
Hondata FP

injector duty here is 81 83 percent
This car managed 209 kw on the same dyno.

Both cars still utilizes a return-less system mr2 has an upgraded QUANTUM 340LPH intank pump.

Both cars have only been road tuned must still hit the rollers.
I have decided to sell the BC stage2's in the mr2 and fit stage 3's also planning on a built sub.
 
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