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Hey Guys,

Planning on improving my K20 Engine, what do you think of the setup? Aiming for around 250whp reliably. Would like to set the rev limiter at 8600rpm.

  • Doctronic ECU
  • Password JDM carbon air chamber
  • Tegiwa Headers and full 3 inch exhaust
  • 70mm throttle body
  • Honda RRC inlet manafold
  • Skunk2 Tuner Stage 1 Camshafts
  • Skunk2 Alpha Valve Spring & Ti Retainer Kit - K20/ K24 & F20C/ F22C
  • Skunk adjustable cam Gears
Very interested on your imput!
 

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Sounds like a decent bolt on and cam package.
But I doubt you see 250 DIN whp this way. Maybe on a very very optimistic dyno.
This would correspond to like 290 hp at the crank.

250 at the crank (210 at the wheels) at 8600 would still be a feat.

For 290 crank HP from a K20 you need a full build with steel rods, high compression forged pistons, oil pump work, larger valves, ITBs etc.
A 87x92 stroker on ITBs and +2mm valves will do 300. Skip the big valves and you see 280. Skip the large ITBs and you see 260.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Sounds like a decent bolt on and cam package.
But I doubt you see 250 DIN whp this way. Maybe on a very very optimistic dyno.
This would correspond to like 290 hp at the crank.

250 at the crank (210 at the wheels) at 8600 would still be a feat.

For 290 crank HP from a K20 you need a full build with steel rods, high compression forged pistons, oil pump work, larger valves, ITBs etc.
A 87x92 stroker on ITBs and +2mm valves will do 300. Skip the big valves and you see 280. Skip the large ITBs and you see 260.
Thanks for your reply! I got my 250whp setup from the article from mywikimotors: Will share the dyno result with my setup (my tuner is using a dynapack, so should be fairly acurate).

"You will need a FD2 throttle body, a cold air intake system, a 4-2-1 header, a 2.5″ exhaust system and a Hondata K-Pro ECU. Install these performance parts, tune the ECU and you will get up to 230 WHP. These are great upgrades for everyday use.
Want 250 HP? In this case, here are the best mods: a cold air intake, a Skunk2 70 mm throttle body, a Skunk2 intake manifold, Skunk2 Stage 2 cams, adjustable cam gears, Skunk2 valve springs and retainers, a 4-2-1 header, a 3″ exhaust system, a lightweight flywheel and RDX 410 cc fuel injectors."
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I chose the stage 1 cams because the car will still be my daily. The stage 1 cams keep the engine unaffected untill 4500rpm.
 

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Arouse the DAMPFHAMMER!
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Aiming for around 250whp reliably. Would like to set the rev limiter at 8600rpm.
Cool engine project Walviskroket :)! What I totally miss is an injector upgrade to e.g. the RDX injectors. The stock K20 injectors won't be sufficient for your power goal, to say nothing of the engine setup is sufficient.

Regarding the power goal I agree with Lotus, without any compression ratio increase you won't be able to have the right cylinder pressure to be able to reach the necessary torque even not at 8600 rpm, when there would be no safety in or of redline to peak power speed difference. If we talk about a 250 flwhp goal, than the injectors may be sufficient at there limit. Duty cycle will hit it's limit most likely.

Questions:
  • Where is your power goal rated? Flywheel or Wheel based?
  • Do you have already a Tuner for the Doctronic ECU?
  • Do you have pictures of the engine build, especially the header and the exhaust?
Markus
 

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Discussion Starter #6
The car will be tuned by Sneaky Tuning in The Netherlands. I will be using is the Tegiwa 4-2-1 header paired with a custom 3 inch exhaust with a 200 cell race catalytic converter. I am not really aiming for numbers, but 250whp sounded like a great number! The think I am aiming for is "Experience" during driving. I think the high reving k20 engine has a way better sound than a k20/k24 frankenstein build.


This is the car now: ep3 type r - YouTube
I only have a cold air intake at the moment, but still have a top speed of around 243kp/h, so think I have a good running engine to start with (100-200 time 18,96 seconds)
 

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Arouse the DAMPFHAMMER!
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The car will be tuned by Sneaky Tuning in The Netherlands. I will be using is the Tegiwa 4-2-1 header paired with a custom 3 inch exhaust with a 200 cell race catalytic converter. I am not really aiming for numbers, but 250whp sounded like a great number! The think I am aiming for is "Experience" during driving. I think the high reving k20 engine has a way better sound than a k20/k24 frankenstein build.
Thanks, the picture now is clearer. But I still miss the injector upgrade.

BTW upgrade, what happens with the 10.000 Euro sponsering for a turbo setup (https://www.k20a.org/threads/k20-turbo-build-10-000-euro-budget-excluding-labour.224103/#post-3306797)? I thought your timeline was much tighter then the relaxed NA build above?
 

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Thanks, the picture now is clearer. But I still miss the injector upgrade.

BTW upgrade, what happens with the 10.000 Euro sponsering for a turbo setup (K20 Turbo build - 10.000 Euro budget (excluding labour) I thought your timeline was much tighter then the relaxed NA build above?
The company that had promised to sponsor the turbo kit didn't do it at the end... Because of that we have decided to share a bolt ons EP3 with our viewers first. This includes a full chassis setup by area motorsports, big brake kit, wavetrack lsd, full exhaust and engine tuning. Once we have finished making content with the NA civic we are going turbo.

For the turbo K20 we will be using the Tegiwa Turbo kit: TEGIWA SIDEWINDER TURBO KIT BOLT ON HONDA CIVIC EP3 TYPE R K20A2
This kit will be available end of june this year, so makes perfect sense.
 

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Thanks for your reply! I got my 250whp setup from the article from mywikimotors: Will share the dyno result with my setup (my tuner is using a dynapack, so should be fairly acurate).

"You will need a FD2 throttle body, a cold air intake system, a 4-2-1 header, a 2.5″ exhaust system and a Hondata K-Pro ECU. Install these performance parts, tune the ECU and you will get up to 230 WHP. These are great upgrades for everyday use.
Want 250 HP? In this case, here are the best mods: a cold air intake, a Skunk2 70 mm throttle body, a Skunk2 intake manifold, Skunk2 Stage 2 cams, adjustable cam gears, Skunk2 valve springs and retainers, a 4-2-1 header, a 3″ exhaust system, a lightweight flywheel and RDX 410 cc fuel injectors."
Hi, first off. Best to talk to your tuner about what internals/boltons to go with. He has the experience what works best and get you closest to the numbers you want. The fact that somebody on some dyno (maybe high reading) got a nr your after doesnt mean you get the same.

2nd. Yes the dynapack is an accurate measuring tool but not that much for real nrs, in the US famous known for its high reading. Also in europe it isn't popular dynoing whp. Everybody around here wants to see crankhp.. And we all know that's we're the dynapack lacks big time in showing real crank nrs. It's a great tool but don't focus on its nrs.

I agree with LotusElise regarding the injectors. The RDX will not only give your engine with that goal enough juice but also give you power on its own.

IMHO there are better headers out there for ep3, you don't need the adjustable camgear with tuner cams and choose the intake piping on its optimal length on the dyno.

Sneaky can give you the right advice on the parts and give you the right tune, just don't focus to much on the nrs. Some dynos in Europe/NL read from 5% up to 10% higher then the low reading dynos.

@Lotus
The average I always see when tuning k series is around 11 to 13% difference in whp to Crank.

@kroket
That means when you want 250whp your talking about around 280 crank hp. The crank hp nrs you see on a dynapack are around 15% so almost 290... Not gonna happen with those simple mods and that Rev limiter, better off with a k24 bottem end.
 

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Hi, first off. Best to talk to your tuner about what internals/boltons to go with. He has the experience what works best and get you closest to the numbers you want. The fact that somebody on some dyno (maybe high reading) got a nr your after doesnt mean you get the same.

2nd. Yes the dynapack is an accurate measuring tool but not that much for real nrs, in the US famous known for its high reading. Also in europe it isn't popular dynoing whp. Everybody around here wants to see crankhp.. And we all know that's we're the dynapack lacks big time in showing real crank nrs. It's a great tool but don't focus on its nrs.

I agree with LotusElise regarding the injectors. The RDX will not only give your engine with that goal enough juice but also give you power on its own.

IMHO there are better headers out there for ep3, you don't need the adjustable camgear with tuner cams and choose the intake piping on its optimal length on the dyno.

Sneaky can give you the right advice on the parts and give you the right tune, just don't focus to much on the nrs. Some dynos in Europe/NL read from 5% up to 10% higher then the low reading dynos.

@Lotus
The average I always see when tuning k series is around 11 to 13% difference in whp to Crank.

@kroket
That means when you want 250whp your talking about around 280 crank hp. The crank hp nrs you see on a dynapack are around 15% so almost 290... Not gonna happen with those simple mods and that Rev limiter, better off with a k24 bottem end.
There seems to be very little information about a K20 frankenstein. Could you give me an idea what parts you should be looking at to get a 250whp k20 frankenstein. If possible I would like to be able to make 8000 rpm
 
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